How do we deal with suffering

My wife and I have been challenged with persecution and suffering. I intend to post more on the details of that here in the next few weeks. In the meantime for those of you who are experiencing true persecution (and I don't mean you got glared at because of your "fish" that you have on your car). I mean real persecution because of your faith or real suffering then I wanted to offer you some encouraging thoughts.

1. God's Grace is sufficient for everyone
2. Pray more, be in the word more
3. Rejoice (easier said than done)
4. Accept the discipline, trial, suffering as a blessing again easier said than done
5. Praise the Lord regardless of the outcome
6. Use it as an opportunity to spread the Gospel
7. Pray that God will get the Glory for all of it

Verses that have been Paramount during this extremely difficult time,
All the Psalms, particularly Psalm 34
Romans 8:28
Romans 5:1-5
1 Corinthians 11:32
1 Thessalonians 5:9-14
Ronmans 12:12

These are just a few of the many verses that God has used to continually remind me that my focus needs to always be on Him.

Spiderman Bible Study?

Wow who would have thought..... is it really relevant that a man spider guy be compared with anything that is Holy? Over at a Little Leaven we get this story...

Spiderman 3 "Bible Study"?!

Those pesky Bible stories sure can be dry, boring and irrelevant. Unbelievers now-a-days prefer the stories in popular movies over the dusty tales of Holy Writ. Isn’t there some way that we can teach 'spirituality' without having to bore people by actually opening the Bible?

Answer: Absolutely! From one of America’s most liberal seminaries, the one that has been teaching its students to ‘de-mythologize the Bible using ‘higher criticism’ for the last 4 decades, comes a “Bible Study” guide that will allow progressive and hip pastors to teach about God’s Word without actually having to open the Bible. This new ‘Bible Study’ is sooooo kewl that it allows pastors to plumb the spiritual depths of that new fountain of spiritual truth, Spiderman 3. (We bet you didn’t even know that Spiderman 3 was a Christian allegory. That’s okay. Neither did we.)

If you take the time to download and read the Spiderman 3 Bible Study Guide, you'll find it is REALLY lite on the scriptures but heavy on 'behavior modification' and the Spiderman 3 story line. Oh, and Jesus isn't mentioned even once in this "Bible Study". (Even Spiderman is a sinner who needs Jesus' mercy and forgiveness). It's as if those folks at Fuller believe that any story can teach us how to be spiritual. It doesn't matter if it is in the Bible or even if the story is true. (That's the problem with the liberals at Fuller, they don't actually believe the Bible is historically accurate.)

Heck! Let's get with the times here! Those fuller dudes are clearly showing us that the church no longer needs expository Bible teaching. Maybe we should just do 'spiritual' movie reviews every sunday at church instead of having a sermon.

If this is what the church has come to, we think it's time to dust off that old 'Titanic Bible Study' because it sure looks like the Christian church is about to sink into the depths.

Fishing at Earth Jam

We had a booth at Earth Jam and it was truly one of the darkest places we have been to. We had a booth right next to Planned Parenthood and got the opportunity to witness to some of them. Our booth was constantly filled with people around it and talking to us. Alan, Jared and Tony all took their turns open air preaching. One of the messages at Earth Jam was tolerance, yet they had little if any tolerance for us. It seems that tolerance is only good if you are aligned with their position. We got the opportunity to have 3 minutes on stage and I gave a quick Gospel presentation. The people we reached on this day would not set foot in a Church no matter how the Church was presented to them. This group needed folks to come to them. Some other funny moments.

-Planned Parenthood complained and wanted us to move and I told the organizers that we were about “peace in the womb” and she was like ya man “peace in the womb!” so we got to stay

-The Psychic’s booth got hit by a gust of wind and flew up in the air and then rolled in the grass, I asked her “what you didn’t see that coming?” She did not think it was funny J

-A guy came by and asked us if we eat meat, I replied yes and he screamed at me “eating meat kills 2 kids every second” I said no I eat chicken and cow. Again he didn’t find it funny J

-Alan was preaching and they asked him to stop, they said his message was to “hard” I guess tolerance is only for soft messages

-Sherry and Michelle witnessed to some guy in a green cape who even I was fearful of; I think he might have been a Druid of some sort

-Julie witnessed to a guy who said “this is tough stuff because this is the first time something like this has been presented to me.”

-Some guy came by who wanted us to pass out his literature, he told us if we don’t then (hippie accent here) then in 7 days we would not be able to buy any fruit juice, this has us concerned we should all stock up on fruit juice? J

-Everyone had the same argument, in fact they all must be going to a school where they are told that the Bible is not translated correctly (hmmm who else says that), Mother Earth is king, Peace and Safety for all (except the unborn), etc.

-Every problem was about George Bush, Global Warming, Meat Eaters, and Wars

-Someone pointed out that they still do not have any new music to listen to, that they played the same stuff that has been around for 40 years

Ultimately our hearts should break for these people who have embraced such an idolatrous and pagan lifestyle. The only way we will ever be “relevant” is by preaching Christ and Him Crucified.

Methods and Persecution

In my prayer and getting ready time this morning, I have been getting mentally and spiritually prepared for the big battle that we are about to face this weekend. God has blessed our little ministry with a booth at a very secular and dark event this weekend. I do not take it lightly that we will have the opportunity to speak for a few minutes to THOUSANDS of non-believers. There may be great persecution in this and as I reflect on my Pastor's thoughts on this I am reminded of this continual relative thinking that is pervading into the hearts and minds of many. Why is this important? There will be a day in this country and we are already seeing it, where it will not be ok to be a Christian, we might not be able to have Churches and the Bible will be banned. This is the legislation that the Homosexuals, Atheists, and even other religions are aiming for.
How many will stand at that time? Will those "Christians" who like to be linked with false truths be able to be cross culturally relational whatever at that time? No I doubt it and based upon one of their recent actions they are liable to throw any Christian under the bus that they do not agree with the way "they" do things. It would appear "they" would turn you over to the authorities in the name of "justice".
As we go into battle this weekend, I want hearts and bodies next to me that are solely committed to the Lord. We have that in our team and church. People who are willing to put a brother before themselves. Not someone who is so interested in perpetuating their methodology that they would let the dark side know about an attempt to bring the Gospel to them. Again it is sad, but I will rejoice when God separates the wheat from the tares, and when persecution comes I long to see those that will be standing ready linked arm in arm. Evil is prevalent and this world embraces it, they will not even say that what happened at Virgina Tech was evil, it was just "relative". We need to start calling a spade a spade and quit embracing all the methodologies that under strain or persecution would have no merit.

Objections to Christianity

This show discusses some of the top objections to Christianity. You can find some of these on www.carm.org

Update #4 Open Letter to LDS Leadership

My friend Bill Mckeever wrote this letter to the LDS leadership. In response to the news items on LDS.org referring to the DVD Distribution as an act of "Hate". I am still blown away by the attitude of the LDS people, the ones who say they are the "only true church" which by their own definition is hateful speech within itself. I find that when they are confronted about their faith it very often becomes contentious for them. Honestly, I do not believe Christians are the same way, confront me, show me your best evidence, I will listen, look, review and reply. We have objective evidence for our faith and therefore we do not rely on the same subjective experiences that Mormons so often defend. I believe that is what it comes down to. Pray for them.

http://www.mrm.org/topics/rebuttals-rejoinders/open-letter-first-presidency-regarding-charge-hatred
April 4, 2007
The First Presidency
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
50 East North Temple
Salt Lake City,
UT 84150-0002

Dear Sirs,
As a Christian living in the Salt Lake Valley, I wish to express my indignation at your church’s tacit approval of the Anti-Defamation League’s accusation of hatred towards Christians who were involved in a recent DVD distribution. It is one thing to disagree with the content of the DVD, but it is quite another to accuse them of being motivated by hate. I will try to temper my outrage by asking the following questions:
* How many people involved in the distribution did you actually speak to who exhibited hatred as their reason for participating?
* What phrase or statement in the DVD resembled anything close to “hate speech”?
* If there is no evidence that the participants were motivated by hatred, are you not guilty of bearing false witness when you make that accusation?
* Isn’t it also duplicitous of you to make such an unfounded accusation of hatred and then retreat to your 177th General Conference to talk about forgiveness and speaking “with the (peaceful) voice of angels”? Jesus talked about such hypocrisy in Matthew 7:1ff.
* You insist that the DVD did not include official sources. It did. However, if official sources really concern you, why did you hide behind an unofficial rebuttal? Why should anybody consider FAIR’s response authoritative since this organization claims it does not officially speak for the LDS Church? Why doesn’t the LDS Church have the courage to offer its own response?
* LDS.org states, “When Latter-day Saint missionaries visit homes or engage others in conversation, they studiously avoid criticism of other faiths. They do not attack and they do not condemn”? Are you really unaware that your present missionary manual clearly states on page 36, “Investigators must be told that a universal apostasy occurred following the death of Jesus and His Apostles. If there had been no apostasy, there would have been no need of a Restoration. As a diamond on black velvet appears more brilliant, so the restoration stands in striking contrast to the dark background of the Great Apostasy. As guided by the Spirit, teach investigators about the Great Apostasy at a level of detail appropriate to their needs and circumstance” (Preach My Gospel, p.36). Do you really not see the hypocrisy in this statement?
* Over the years I have listened politely to numerous missionaries tell me about Joseph Smith’s alleged First Vision. Do you really think Christians such as I should not feel criticized when we are told that our churches are wrong, our creeds are an abomination, and that Christian “professors” are corrupt?
* At your 177th General Conference, it was stated, “I know that heaven-sent revelations have replaced the gross errors of man made doctrines concerning the Godhead.” Is this not a criticism directed at millions of Christians?
* If the LDS Church had its people place information on doors in neighborhoods and Christians made a concerted effort to remove this information (as Mormons have bragged they did), wouldn’t that be called stealing? Why is it that the Mormons who did this do not see it as such?
* If the Christian community responded to an evangelistic effort by the LDS Church with the loud, angry voices exhibited recently by Latter-day Saints, wouldn’t your members accuse the Christians of persecuting them? Why should these actions not be considered persecution against Christians?
Please bear in mind that I am not saying that Mormons do not have the right to believe whatever they wish; in fact, I have often strongly supported their right to do so. I would only ask that you, as leaders of this church, be honest with the media and the general public when it comes to the subject of criticism and the charge of hatred.
With all of the talk of repentance at your last conference, I think you need to lead by example and offer an apology to the thousands of Christians you have offended with this false accusation.

Sincerely,
Bill McKeever
Director,
Mormonism Research Ministry

Misused Bible Verses

This is the show on misused Bible verses. I will say I was distracted a lot during the filming of this.

A thought

Because as Christians we use the Old Testament and believe in the same prophets as the Jewish people are we then Jews? So even though a Mormon uses a Bible and ascribes to morality issues that are similar to Christians. They would even agree on historical aspects of Jesus, just not His person, nature, intention, etc. Are they then Christian? I think this is a good parallel to draw and am interested on your comments on it.

Update #3 on Mormon DVD

John Morehead stopped by and made a comment on the first of the three posts here. He corrected me on the term "relationalist". Going forward I will make note of this that the term they would like to be called is "cross-culture mission minded" I completely understand that we must be culturally sensitive to some degree. We should understand basic cultural things especially if we are going on a mission to that area. I live in Utah so I understand the basics and the advanced Mormonism doctrine, theology, culture etc. I am just not sure how telling them the Truth of the Great Gospel is anything but relational. I would be amiss to not tell them the truth, to build some false sense of relationship with them only to spring on them at a later time with the truth. I find that regardless of how mission minded you are we need to speak the truth in gentleness and respect to Mormons. Frankly they appreciate it! Some don't but those are the same people who are going to be hateful regardless of what you do. In addition it corresponds culturally, religiously and theologically with how they do mission work. I have never been a proponent of letting the culture dictate how we Evangelize, yet if I had to justify it that way it could be easily done. Here are some quotes that are notable from MORMONS! I would say that they WANT us to tell them the truth or they are just saying this to have an alibi?

Here is a quote
Orson Pratt: (on the Book of Mormon) this book must be either true or false, if
false it is one of the most cunning wicked bold deep-laied impositions ever pawned
upon the world. Calculated to deceive and ruin millions who will really receive it
as the word of God... If after a rigid examination it be found an imposition it should
be extensively published to the world as such the evidences and arguments upon
which the impostor was detected should be clearly and logically stated. ..
(the Divine authority of the book of Mormon)”

Here are two more

Joseph Fielding Smith: Mormonism, as it is called, must stand
or fall on the story of Joseph Smith. He was either a prophet of
God, divinely called, properly appointed and commissioned, or he
was one of the biggest frauds this world has ever seen. There is no
middle ground. “If Joseph Smith was a deceiver, who willfully
attempted to mislead the people, then he should be exposed; his
claims should be refuted, and his doctrines shown to be false,...”
(Doctrines of Salvation, vol.1, pp. 188-189)

Gordon B Hinkley: (on Joseph Smith’s 1st vision) Our whole
strength rests on the validity of that vision. It either occurred or
it did not occur. If it did not, then this work is a fraud. (President
Gordon B. Hinkley, “The Marvelous Foundation of Our Faith,”
Ensign, Nov. 2002, 80.)

I will stick with using the Bible as a guide for Evangelism and my only guide.

I also want to add a quote from a discussion on another blog at STR. I do not know him but in his conversation with a Mormon he articulated a quote that I have heard before, and used variations of yet his was far more concise. Here is the quote

"Further, if Christianity is potentially true, then it is potentially false. Christianity is potentially false as it rides on a historical event - the resurrection. I don't think we can draw the same parrallel to Mormonism. What sets Mormonism apart, the missionaries tell me, is that I can pray and ask God for wisdom and "I will know the BOM is true" in my heart....by the "burning of my bosom". There is no objective, external, falsifiable test for a religion that claims such a thing..... "Our religious text is true, because I prayed and God revealed to me that it was true." Now how did god reveal such a thing?.....did he literally transplant the thought into your head, such that his thoughts are now your thoughts? It's kind of hard for me to argue with God isn't it?!

What if I prayed about the BOM and God told me it's the work of the devil? Who's right Kevin? Are we forever lost on this sea of relativity, or do you think there is some objective test that could settle the issue?"by John Willis.

Update #2 on response to Mormon DVD

Ok so I am absolutely tired of the hypocritical view here in Utah. Mormons send missionaries in a sneak attack to my door, they then tell me that Christianity is wrong because they are the only "true" church through modern day prophets. Uh... what is the difference between that and showing them with provable history that Joseph Smith was a fraud as a prophet. In fact in the tradition of Mormonism here is some of their quotes with some very hateful language against Christianity. Here is a great article by Bill Mckeever on this very topic.

"Behold there are save two churches only; the one is the Church of the Lamb of God and the other is the church of the devil; wherefore whoso belongeth not to the church of the lamb of God belongeth to that great church; which is the mother of abominations; and she is the sleeper of all the earth." (The Book of Mormon, 1 Nephi 14:10)

"Nothing less than a complete apostasy from the Christian religion would warrant the establishment of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints." (Documentary History of the Church, Introduction, xl)

"I was answered that I must join none of them (Christian Churches), for they were all wrong...that all their creeds were an abomination in His sight" (Joseph Smith History 1:19).

"...orthodox Christian views of God are Pagan rather than Christian." (Mormon Doctrine of Deity by B.H. Roberts, p.116)

"...the God whom the 'Christians' worship is a being of their own creation..." (Apostle Charles W. Penrose, JD 23:243)

"The Christian world, so called, are heathens as to their knowledge of the salvation of God." (Brigham Young, JD 8:171)

"We may very properly say that the sectarian world do not know anything correctly, so far as pertains to salvation. Ask them where heaven is?- where they are going to when they die?-where Paradise is! -and there is not a priest in the world that can answer your questions. Ask them what kind of a being our Heavenly Father is, and they cannot tell you so much as Balaam's ass told him. They are more ignorant than children." (Brigham Young, JD 5:229).

"The Christian world, I discovered, was like the captain and crew of a vessel on the ocean without a compass, and tossed to and fro whithersoever the wind listed to blow them. When the light came to me, I saw that all the so-called Christian world was grovelling in darkness." (Brigham Young, JD 5:73).

"What! Are Christians ignorant? Yes, as ignorant of the things of God as the brute best." (John Taylor, JD 13:225)

"What does the Christian world know about God? Nothing...Why so far as the things of God are concerned, they are the veriest fools; they know neither God nor the things of God." (John Taylor, JI) 13:225)

"Believers in the doctrines of modern Christendom will reap darnation to their souls (Bruce R. McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, p.177)

"I have learned for myself that Presbyterianism is not true." (Joseph Smith, DHC 1:6)

"I spoke of the impropriety of turning away from the truth, and going after a people so destitute of righteousness as the Methodists." (Joseph Smith, DHC 2:319)

"...brother Joseph B. Nobles once told a Methodist priest, after hearing him describe his god, that the god they worshiped was the "Mormon's" Devil-a being without a body, whereas our God has a body, parts and passions." (Brigham Young, JD 5:331)

"...brother Heber C. Kimball was beset by a number of Baptist priests who had been attending a conference. He read them all down out of the New Testament....With regard to true theology, a more ignorant people never lived than the present so-called Christian world." (Brigham Young, JD 8:199).

"The Roman Catholic, Greek, and Protestant church, is the great corrupt, ecclesiastical power, represented by great Babylon...." (Orson Pratt, Orson Pratt, Writings of an Apostle, "Divine Authenticity," no.6, p.84).

"...all the priests who adhere to the sectarian religions of the day with all their followers, without one exception, receive their portion with the devil and his angels." (The Elders Journal, Joseph Smith Jr., editor, vol.1, no.4, p.60)

"And any person who shall be so wicked as to receive a holy ordinance of the gospel from the ministers of any of these apostate churches will be sent down to hell with them, unless they repent of the unholy and impious act." (Orson Pratt, OP-WA, "The Kingdom of God," no.2, p.6)

"...all other churches are entirely destitute of all authority from God; and any person who recieves baptism or the Lord's supper from their hands will highly offend God, for he looks upon them as the most corrupt people." (Orson Pratt, The Seer, pg. 255)

"...the great apostate church as the anti-christ...This great antichrist...is the church of the devil." (Apostle Bruce R. McConkie, Mormon Doctrine p.40)

"Both Catholics and Protestants are nothing less than the "sleeper of Babylon" whom the lord denounces by the mouth of John the Revelator as having corrupted all the earth by their fornications and wickedness." (Pratt, The Seer, p.255)

"Brother Taylor has just said that the religions of the day were hatched in hell. The eggs were laid in hell, hatched on its borders, and then kicked on to the earth." (Brigham Young, JD 6:176)

"Evil spirits control much of the so-called religious worship in the world; for instance, the great creeds of Christendom were formulated so as to conform to their whispered promptings." (Bruce R. McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, p.246)

"After the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints was organized, there were only two churches upon the earth. They were known respectively as the Church of the Lamb of God and Babylon. The various organizations which are called churches throughout Christiandom, though differing in their creeds and organizations, have one common orgin. They belong to Babylon." (George Q. Cannon, Gospel Truth, p.324)

Finally, note the views of Mormon Prophet Brigham Young regarding the Christian view of Jesus Christ:

"You may hear the divines of the day extol the character of the Saviour, undertake to exhibit his true character before the people, and give an account of his origin...I have frequently thought of mules, which you know are half horse and half ass, when reflecting upon the representations made by those divines. I have heard sectarian priests undertake to tell the character of the Son of God, and they make him half of one species and half of another, and I could not avoid thinking at once of the mule, which is the most hateful creature that ever was made, I believe. You will excuse me, but I have thus thought many a time."
(Journal of Discourses 4:217)

Thank you Robert Parker for the quotes

DVD Outreach a "Hate Crime"?

I have revised this post as of 4/3/07 .....there has been some comments from LDS authorities and media sensationalists crying foul and worse yet using terms like "hate crime" "sneak attack" "violation of rights" against the Christians who distributed the DVD. I am concerned that it will be none too soon when we will not be able to tell Mormons the truth of the Gospel without it being called a "Hate Crime". There are many debates as to how to approach Mormons. There seems to be two sides to this debate more traditional Biblical way and the culturally sensitive pragmatists/relationalist. The people who take the relational approach to witnessing to Mormons have not stood against the Mormon Church. Even during this time we have not seen anything but an opposition to the DVD. Organizations like Standing Together or John Morehead's many projects. In fact Morehead went so far as to oppose the DVD outreach publicly and let the information leak out about it in the name of "justice". How is that for divisiveness. If John and the other relationalist are so convinced to being relational with Mormons, why do they not apply that with other Christians. Hmmm looks like...... a double standard. I think it will be sad for all of us when no one will be allowed to even have a truth conversation with Mormon. Here is a link to an article in response to Morehead here and then another here. In addition here is a link to a blog with a lot of recent debate over this (they have been temporarily hidden), as well as a conversation with some "relational only" Christians. Why do I associate the issue of this outreach and the relationalists? Well because the relationalist are fueling the fire for the LDS Church, to give them the benefit of the doubt they may not knowingly be doing that. See the LDS response to the DVD used terms like "dialogue" and "friendship". These terms are used by relationalist to support the conversations with the LDS Church. The amazing part about all this is that if this continues where issues of Homosexuality has in places like Canada it has all the makings for some scary legislation here in Utah. How will we be culturally sensitive then when we will be silenced by law for our faith? I am pleading with anyone who is a "Christian" to step up now and stop supporting the LDS Churches move into the Christian Category and realize that the term Anti-Mormon is thrown around far to often and unchecked. This is about "truth" and it is time to start contending for the faith.