Monday, June 25, 2007

And you thought we were joking!

This is scary, a few posts ago we talked about the According To You Bible and the Erasable Bible. These two Bibles were a work of fiction but proved a necessary point. In Christendom today many people take out parts or ignore parts of their Bibles because they do not like what it says. Mormons, JW's, and other Non Christian Groups do this as well. Now however everyone will be appeased as we look at this post from:

A Little Leaven

The Sinless, Wrathless Bible

Do you feel uncomfortable when you read your Bible because it talks about things like sin, God's judgement and his wrath? Don't you wish you could have a Bible that omitted all that negative and scary stuff?

You're in luck!!

Kenneth Winston Caine has created The Positive Bible. According to the publisher:

Turn to any page in this book. You will be greeted with a Biblical passage that offers hope, help, and encouragement. This collection of advice, instruction, inspiration, assurance, and wisdom, drawn from the King James, Revised Standard, New International, King James Modernized, and The Living Bible translations by scholar Kenneth Winston Caine, has the power and beauty to teach and comfort across the centuries.

Ponder just one passage or every one; browse this book at random or read it straight through. Find a problem or question in the index of more than 250 everyday life applications of scripture-from healing to living through grief to nurturing a child- and you will be directed to Biblical wisdom that speaks precisely to you, as timely and relevant to modern culture as the evening newscast. Here is your inspirational guide to the most remarkable of all books-condensed compendium of truth and knowledge that will enrich your entire family for years to come.

Ahh yes. There is nothing like making a Bible to suit your own tastes and religious notions. But wait, isn't that the very definition of idolatry?


bholcomb said...

WOW! A reminder that we are living in wicked days...just one of many "signs of the times".

L. Curtis said...


truth for the lost said...

Hey Andy, Leonard, how's it going? Sheldon here.

Still keeping at it I see. Good to see motivated people of faith, even if I disagree at times (haven't seen you in my backyard recently but maybe we'll run into each other again sometime).

I've been checking on and off again at your blog, and for the most part, you have some good arguments, and I applaud you for stressing the importance of reading the correct translation of scripture.

I do wish you woudn't feel the need to lump Mormons in with people who 'ignore parts of the Bible?' though.

That aside, it isn't too hard to imagine why the so-called 'mainstream' individuals and groups try to pull out what truth they can from the Bible, seeing how there are contradictions, errors, truths that have been lost. Many are simply grasping at what they can hold onto because of all the distortion.

I'm not trying to open up a can of worms on this, but let's be honest here: there is not a definitive yes or no, approved of or denied, tally of sorts by the mainstream on every principle in the bible. Yours and others' ministry is proof in itself, that only a few aspects of the gospel are highlighted and amplified, however well-packaged they may be. Take the "Way of the Master' for instance. There is more to the gospel than what is being stressed. Maybe this is due to the individuals or state of the world in which they try to preach to, but still. It is not complete, however good yours, and their intentions are.

And so, as you've mentioned, there are others who merely seek to interpret meanings from scripture, to fit themselves, either out of ignorance or confusion (the latter part due in large part to the biblical errors).

Don't get me wrong, I'm not defending this behavior. I claim discipleship of Christ's only gospel and church, and so my understanding of scripture is more than personal, it is doctrinal, historical, and proclaimed by His servants, as it is intended.

My point is this: whenever news comes about, detailng the deviations of so-called Christian churches from holy doctrine, (the homosexual issue, for instance) it simply reiterates to me their apostate condition and the divisiveness within the 'mainstream.'

And as I'm sure you are aware, a house divided cannot stand.

Andy said...

Sheldon thanks for stopping by. We have been in your backyard every week but last week and we will be working on a big project this week. Expect us back real soon.

I want to address your email point by point.

I am not arguing against translations here on this post. I have studied that topic intensely. What we are discussing here which I think you got is that the Bible is full of all of God's characteristics and teachings not just the ones we want. And then you must read them in CONTEXT. Mormons unfortunately do not read the Bible in context they proof text it to try and support their other doctrines (i.e. 1 Cor 15:40) that was the reason for my comment.

Their is distortion of God's word and many so called "Christians" distort it throughly.

Sheldon you will have to list the definitives here. I will say that things like fasting are implied but not codified, or the age of accountability. If you understand the Bible and the nature of God, He had good reason not to give specifics on issues like these. They would be abused.

Please show me where the Way of the Master is an incomplete Gospel presentation. I think it is very complete and based on scripture more importantly on how Jesus presented it to people.

You claim discipleship of Christ Sheldon, yet you believe in apostate and heretical doctrines. This is what concerns me.

I think you are trying to get a jab in because there are churches claiming "Christianity" that do not reflect Christianity. Many Churches have deviated from the truth and continue to do so. This is a prime example of false churches, false truths, false prophets and false christs that Matthew 24 warns about.

Andy said...

Oh yeah and isnt the LDS church have 4 different sects to it. which one of those is true? Oh wait you are multi denominational.

L. Curtis said...

Actually, Andy, there have been over 100 offshoot groups that came from the original mormon faith (the Salt Lake church is NOT the true mormon faith. Brigham Young and Joseph Smith would be ex-communicated from the original church and G. B. Hinckley would have blood atonement used on him for his heresies in the real mormon church) and each of these groups all claim to be the "one and only true church led by a living prophet" and all claim J. Smith as their founder.......

Sheldon, you claim such loss from the Bible. Show it to me. I bet I can prove you wrong.

But then while we are there, I will show you where there have been 3,973 different changes to the book of mormon.... UH OH!, not to mention the changes to the D&C and POGP.

Also, we can discuss how the Egyptian Papyri have conclusively been proven to NOT be what Joe claimed they were.
So please, if you are going to state such things, come with evidence. I certainly will.

See you soon.

truth for the lost said...


Thanks for replying. Your comments seem to suggest that we both agree there is distortion and disunity in the mainstream. Your thoughts about doctrines being 'abused' are correct but whether they are abused in totality or in degree means nothing as it all comes down to the simple reality that all of his doctrines have been abused, IF they are practiced in a way that is incorrect and without priesthood authority. This is the main point.

Isaiah 24:5 is one example of this taking place...

“The earth also is defiled under the inhabitants thereof; because they have transgressed the laws, changed the ordinance, broken the everlasting covenant. “

Whether there is 1 or 1000 churches that state to follow Christs' teachings, it means nothing if in fact the true authority does not exist. Because the Bible clearly puts forth this necessity and the proscribed way this takes place, several times and in several ways.

The truth is that while there are thousands upon thousands of ministries that claim to preach the "way of the Master," there are only a minority that officially claim to be his ONLY true church, as it was established, with His complete gospel and priesthood authority. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints claims "Restored Christianity" as do some offshoots from this foundation (orinating from the Prophet Joseph Smith). The Catholic Church claims continuity of the priesthood authority. This is the weakest link in all of the 'other ministries' of the so-called mainstream:

It is either the continuation of priesthood keys and authority since ancient days (as the Catholics profess) or it is the restoration of these powers in the latter days (as Mormons claim, and as the Bible predicts). ALL other 'Christian' movements are either offshoots of these two movements in some form.

And knowing this reality, this is why these other ministries 'dumb down' the gospel to nothing more than a prayer. Nothing more than a motivational seminar. Nothing more than sweaty preachers and a telephone number where the viewer can call to give them money.

Nothing about baptism AND the holy ghost by laying on of hands by one having authority. Nothing about the billions of souls before Christ, and those that do or will never no Christ in the flesh. Nothing about saving ordinances and temples. Nothing about tithes and offerings.
Et cetera...

Distortion is all that exists in
the mainstream. Apostasy is all that exists in the mainstream. Greed and creedalism is all that exists int the mainstream. But NOT Christianity.


Hey, how's it going? To address your questions about the Bible, let me begin by stating that I believe there are profound truths therein, beautiful things and words that are directly as God intended them to be understood.

But there are also many errors. This is obvious, and the blame is placed on those that translated the records. Human error. We could get into how the Bible as the world has known it basically came from the Catholic Church and the interpretation of the Trinity/Godhead among other things...were continually changing even hundreds of years before it was even allowed to be in any other language...and the protestant groups began, because they knew for certain there were gross errors and practices. We could get into discussions about the Councils upon Councils setup with notable figures of the time (Shakespeare being one of them) where by no call of God, no authority to translate, were allowed to take this project on. Where basically they sat around debating doctrines, based merely on logic. Again, NO MAN can take this honor unto himself. He must be called, "as was Aaron."

But if purely historical evidence (and there are mountains of it) do not persuade you that the Bible has been changed and truths lost, and evil men have sought to mislead, I'll provide you with some more examples from the Bible.

Look at the record of Paul's vision. Two versions exist. Both contradict the other.

First, Acts 9:7: "And the men which journeyed with him stood speechless hearing a voice, but seeing no man."

Now, the Acts 22:9 version: "And they that were with me saw indeed the light, but they heard not the voice of him that spake to me."

There you go. There are more. Judas' Death, for instance.
Matt: 27:5 reads, "And he cast down the pieces of silver in the temple, and departed, and went and hanged himself."

Acts 1:18, however, is: "Now this man purchased a field with the reward of iniquity and fall-headlong, he burst asunder in the midst, and all his bowels gushed out."

Again, there are other examples. And this is probably the most troubling. That whole books of scripture, are in fact, missing, lost or taken out:

Book of the Covenant: Exodus 24:7
Book of the Wars of the Lord: Numbers 21:14
Book of Jasher: Joshua 10:13
Book of the Acts of Solomon (I would've loved to read this): 1-KINGS 11:41
Books of Nathan and Gad: 1 Chronicles 29:29
Prophecy of Ahijah and the Visions of Iddo: 2 Chronicles 9:29
Book of Shemaiah: 2 Chronicles 12:15
Book of Jehu: 2 Chronicles 20:34
Acts of Uzziah: 2 Chronicles 26:22
Sayings of the Seers 2 Chronicles 33:19
An earlier epistle of Paul to the Corinthians: 1 Corinthians 5:9
Another epistle of Paul to the Ephesians: Ephesians 3:3
An epistle of Paul to Loadicea: Colossians 4:16
Former epistle of Jude: Jude 3
Prophesies of Enoch (wou'dve loved this too) Jude 14

I could go on and on. Fortunately (as a loving Father has stated) there are books of scripture (and men called by Him and His Son directly) that have restored these truths.

L. Curtis said...

Oh, I LOVE this stuff.

First, you have done nothing more then regurgitate what your leaders have preached. There is not evidence there for some continuation of your priesthood and the evidence is actually stacked against what you call the priesthood having ever existed.

One high priest, no 12 year old deacons, and a definate Jewish lineage for anyone to claim the priesthood would be a great place to start.

Furthermore, you claim that each of these books that are mentioned must therefore be included in the Bible. That is just not so. If I wrote a book and quoted from another one in mine, would I therefore also have to include the other books text in my book? Of course not.

And if you are going to bring forth "contradictions" you will have to do better then that.

So what if Judas hung from a tree and then his rotted body fell and burst forth? Sounds logical to me. Can't imagine a man walking in a field and tripping and gushing forth any other way. And the money that was thrown into the temple being blood money, could not be put into the treasury, so the field was bought with it.

And as for the tellings of Paul, not a problem there either. The men certainly could not hear the message of the One who came bringing it.

So, should we not begin talking about the doctrinal changes to the book of mormon????

L. Curtis said...


I was also thinking about your saying all those books had been removed from the Bible.

Since Joseph Smith completed his "translation" of the Bible, calling it the "inspired version" why did he not put even one of those supposedly removed "plain and precious truths" back in? In fact, he even removed the entire book of Song of Solomon and 'restored' nothing.

Andy said...


I think your heart is reveled in your posts. I will respond to it.

There is distortions among many who call themselves "Christian" the Mormon faith is the epitome of this. They have a different Jesus than the one in the Bible. Sheldon are you sure your sins are all forgiven?

A prayer does not save you and the Bible opposes such teaching, but it also opposes what you advocate that Baptism saves you. Please read your Bible.

The authority that you speak of is nil. No where in the Bible is such an authority ever been demonstrated as the myth of Mormonism has created. All authority was not given in baptism it was given by God to the prophets in direct revelation and then proven in their prophetic sayings. Joesph Smith would not fall into this category since he tried to distort this, and his prophecies did not validate him. Your authority argument has no Biblical basis so please take it elsewhere.

Jason Epps said...

All I can say is, "Wow!" They really DID print a Bible with just the good stuff! I was kind of thinking about applying that to my citizenship here in the USA. Maybe I'll continue to enjoy the roads, the police, the education, the freedom, the military protection, but I'll ignore the laws to pay my taxes. That way, I'll get the most possible benefit from my country, but I don't have to deal with any of the responsibility that makes my freedom possible. I think I'll call it... The United States of Latter-day Citizens!


L. Curtis said...


Is that the one true country on the face of the whole earth and are you sure you translated it all correctly?